willem
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posted on 5-10-2004 at 09:53
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Centre of gravity measurement for bodies
All,
We all know that the centre of gravity of a car plays an essential role in the performance of the car. We want to keep this as low as possible.
Untill now we've had lots of discussions in how to make sure the cars are as equal as possible in terms of rules and regulations and allowed
bodies and / or allowed modifications or used materials.
This is an endless discussion and will never stop untill there is a clear and simple method to control and measure the centre of gravity of especially
the body including the body suspensions.
To kill this endless discussion ERWIN RAMTECH BOERSE created (in his head) a device which measures the height
of the centre. See picture!
To calculate the height of the centre of gravity we use a simple formula:
W = width of the body
a = angle of the device (see picture)
H = height centre of gravity
Formula
H = TAN ( 90 - a ) * 0.5 * W
Example:
W = 84 mm
a = 80 degrees
H = 7,41 mm
This control mechanisme allows us to easily determine whether your body meets the requirments set in the rules and regulations not dependent on
whatever material or components used to fabricate to body.
Another advantage is that it's easy to check at home whether you're body is OK.
Every class will have it's own fallover angle to assure fair comparison.
willem has attached this image:
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slotmad
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posted on 5-10-2004 at 10:33
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Leuk initiatief,
Echter per klasse kunnen we kiezen uit verschillende gehomologeerde kappen. Tussen de kappen in een klasse zijn aanmerkelijke verschillen qua hoogte
en breedte (en wielbasis) en daarmee op het zwaartepunt. Hoe wil je dat "recht" trekken? Vergelijk bijvoorbeeld eens de Ferrari Modena met de
smallere en hoger Audi TT. Volgens mij focust de discussie te veel op de kappen, terwijl in mijn ogen toch wel "bewezen" is dat met praktisch elke
kap (=auto) in een klasse hard gegaan kan worden, mits de totale wegligging c.q. afstelling goed is en de coureur een goed vinger heeft. Zie
bijvoorbeeld wat Nick de laatste tijd bestuurt en wat Philip in het verleden op de baan heeft gebracht.
Slotmad
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willem
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posted on 5-10-2004 at 12:01
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Missing the point (By the way: keep thread in english)
I think you're missing the point. The maximum width and weight as well is diameters and other rules are preset for every category.
To adjust this the driver can either reduce his body weight on the right places or stick lead or other heavy material on the right places.
It's the responsibility of the driver / team to make sure his car meets the requirments, not the organisation! The fallover angle as I'm
refering to it, is just another value which needs ot be reckoned with during the building of the car.
I don't see your point as if the discussion is focusing on the bodies? What discussion are you referring to? To make a coar go fast most of the
essential variables influencing the performance need tob e setup correctly, what's new about that?
This measurement device is just another aid to assure nobody can deliberatly circumvent to rules!
What's your point?
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Gert
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posted on 5-10-2004 at 16:58
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Easy job
Make your rules so that all the cars are legal
Forbid replacements of original parts.
And you wil not need that divice you are talking about.
i just wonder when the first CARBON / LEXAN Model car will be on the track.
Greetz Gert:Where is the fun in slotracing
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Gert
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posted on 5-10-2004 at 18:48
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| Quote: | Oorspronkelijk gepost door willem
All,
Untill now we've had lots of discussions in how to make sure the cars are as equal as possible in terms of rules and regulations and allowed
bodies and / or allowed modifications or used materials.
Is it ok for me to laugh out loud
This is an endless discussion and will never stop untill there is a clear and simple method to control and measure the centre of gravity of especially
the body including the body suspensions.
To kill this endless discussion we're going to build a clear and simple device which measures the height of the centre. See picture!
To calculate the height of the centre of gravity we use a simple formula:
W = width of the body
a = angle of the device (see picture)
H = height centre of gravity
Formula
H = TAN ( 90 - a ) * 0.5 * W
Example:
W = 84 mm
a = 80 degrees
H = 7,41 mm
This control mechanisme allows us to easily determine whether your body meets the requirments set in the rules and regulations not dependent on
whatever material or components used to fabricate to body.
Great Joke
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Greetz Gert the 1st of April is stil far away Willem
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gabe2001
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posted on 5-10-2004 at 19:59
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not a joke
I guess - and it looks like it could be working. I'm sure it will "filter out" the cars where extra wheight is being glued as low as possible,
instead of where the rules say, in case of a too light body.
Also, I think that for the various classes we have the minimal height rule and all the other measures which in total with the "tipping over
threshold" (how about calling it TOT :-) ) could provide a more even field of cars.
And yes, the rest is chassis tuning and driving skills...
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Gert
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posted on 5-10-2004 at 20:30
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Weight ?
Well Gabe my friend it's going to far with all those things,
and it wil kil slotracing in the way we play that game.
I feel pitty fore those who use that kind of tricks to cheat.
And I only talk about the Model section .
Greetz Gert: 
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willem
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posted on 6-10-2004 at 06:12
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Gert
Make your rules so that all the cars are legal
Forbid replacements of original parts.
And you wil not need that divice you are talking about.
i just wonder when the first CARBON / LEXAN Model car will be on the track.
Greetz Gert:Where is the fun in slotracing |
That was already a year ago Gert. Your running behind!@#
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willem
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posted on 6-10-2004 at 06:16
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Gert
Well Gabe my friend it's going to far with all those things,
and it wil kil slotracing in the way we play that game.
I feel pitty fore those who use that kind of tricks to cheat.
And I only talk about the Model section .
Greetz Gert: |
Grow up Gert! Your being naive I don't have to tell you who are
the greates cheaters in the world, I think you know....And I don't care where Utopia lies. I care for those who let them selves being cheated all
the time...
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JustMe
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posted on 6-10-2004 at 08:59
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MAUW!!!
jongens jongens.....
goed idee vind ik van Willem, al moet ik zeggen dat toen hij het me uitlegde op de club dat ik dacht; crap.
Maar om het veld een stuk gelijker te krijgen zou het een goede oplossing zijn om bijvoorbeeld te zorgen dat er overall geen Corvettes meer winnen
 aahhh he lekker.
Maar ik zou niet zomaar elk idee verwerpen, zu een goede kunnen zijn
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willem
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posted on 6-10-2004 at 09:07
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Correction: GOED IDEE VAN TWEETY RAMTECH BOERSE
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gabe2001
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posted on 7-10-2004 at 00:02
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There is merrit in this new concept of combining center of gravity and TOT and model cars. Eventually, this new measure could make things simpler.
Picture this:
(*) you know what the minimum weight of the body has to be - the better your scale at home the more accurately you can weigh it;
(*) you know what the maximum width and minimum height of the body is - easily measured with your rusty caliper gauge (Schieblehre/schuifmaat)
(*) build yourself the interior which goes with your body and mount it into the same - so that you can remove it again of course
(*) now you also need to add the body-to-chassis mounting parts to your body
and voila you're ready for the TOT test.
If the body tips over when placed on the slanted surface your car has a center of gravity which is higher than required (the easier it tips over the
higher the center of gravity).
This is where you could decide to apply the Dremel to the roof of your body and bringing the CoG further down. Or, for the same effect, add led to the
lower parts of your body.
As you can guess, it now doesn't matter anymore how you achieve the CoG and TOT. In combination with width/height/weight the bodies automatically
are more equal than current rules alow to measure it.
Cheaters et al have to find new ways to gain an advantage over the average slot racer - and that's a good thing as it may yield new (amazing)
discoveries...
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fola
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posted on 4-10-2005 at 09:01
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Deep.
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Kai
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posted on 19-2-2006 at 10:05
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Has anyone build this, or is it still only theory ?
Sincerely,
Kai Bach Andersen.
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tamar
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posted on 19-2-2006 at 13:06
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Theory
| Quote: | Originally posted by Kai
Has anyone build this, or is it still only theory ? |
Although the theory is sound and simple, building the divice was not. Biggest problem was to find a universal way to mount the bodies on the measuring
device. Simplest way would be to use the body mounts used to fit the body to the chassis. downside was that you would have to make adaptors for all
the available brand's/types of chassis 
So the answer is...........Theory 
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ramtech
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posted on 19-2-2006 at 20:39
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the problem is mostly time related
armen zijn nu echt te kort
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Kai
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posted on 19-2-2006 at 22:05
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Tamar, the plate or the pan could be steel (like the SlotWorld.dk ones), and the fixation of the wheels could be neodymium magnets from any 1:32
car.
The scale for measuring degrees can be found in any childs pencilcase.
Sincerely,
Kai Bach Andersen.
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